Phil Johnson: Licensees are not police
22 April, 2008
Monday night is pub night and a few beers with my mates, a longstanding start of week arrangement and a night of singular merriment. Well, it used to be!
Once upon a time, not so long ago, I used to march to the pub with a spring in my step eagerly anticipating that first glorious pint and the start of the banter. Last night, despite the relatively mild weather my step was leisurely, almost wearisome for there was no need to rush anymore.
The doors were open, welcoming allcomers to the delights within but there didn't seem as if a whole heap of welcoming had gone on!
A teenager and his girlfriend banged a few pool balls around almost lethargically until the young gentleman politely allowed his wench to pot the black and claim victory.
Having claimed the opening pint of the night I turned my back to the bar to survey the faces within. There were no faces within; eight o'clock and I was the customer base!
About half an hour later Ron & Jack limped in and ordered their usual halves and Ron had his brandy chaser with his, before retiring to their usual seats to discuss the war for the ten thousanth time. They are lonely as well. Before July last year 'Billyboy' and 'Jacko' used to meet them and also talk about the war but they've been outed by the smoking ban.
Ron bemoaned their absence: "84 yrs old and I fought for this bloody country but I can't even sit with my mates anymore!"
I could only sympathise with him.
Jack wished Tony Blair had been in the trenches with him, "He'd 'ave bin fust over the bloody top," he muttered disconsolately into his beer.
I ordered another pint, praying for a friendly face to appear through that hallowed portal. My prayer was not answered. The youngsters had departed from the delights of the green baize, so that was it-me and two octgenarians. What a bundle of laughs!
The barmaid tried to busy herself but there were no empty glasses to collect, no beermats to straighten and not even any ashtrays to clean!
She told me of a landlady somewhere near Lancaster who had been fined £365 because a female customer had lit a cigarette up in her pub. Apparently the landlady had been at the local Cash&Carry when this event occurred!
Apparently the presiding magistrate said, "Let that be a lesson to you".
Now what sort of statement is that I ask? It also transpired that the dastardly smoker was not prosecuted-only the landlady who was absent at the time! How can that be?
This gave me much room for thought, for if smokers were not being prosecuted for smoking in an enclosed space and/or a workplace, why is it that the licensee is liable, especially, as in this case, the licensee wasn't even on site?
It became increasingly obvious to me that this gov't have set their stall out to get money out of the smokeban even if it is not the smokers that pay it!
Licensees have a hard enough job at the best of times and it is humanly impossible to be on hand every minute of the day or night. This therefore means that any spurious phone call to the Environment Office could lead to a prosecution of the most innocent of licensees.
In fact, why are the licensees liable at all? They have complied with the signage ordered by the government and removed all the ashtrays. Soon all the fag machines will be gone and the government has ordered each council to employ a 'smoke plod squad'!
Surely it is the duty of these EHOs to go round the pubs - that is what they get paid more than twenty grand a year for! Or are they paid such money to sit next to a phone awaiting what may or may not be the next spurious phone call from some malicious anti smoker?
Licensees should not have to 'police' their own premises - they serve beer and food to customers. An Italian Court has ruled that the licensee of a premises is not liable for policing his establishment-that is the job of those specifically employed for that purpose.
Now that will be intersting: if we do get bludgeoned into this European SuperQuagmireState, will landlords still be prosecuted if a smoker lights-up?
According to italian law, no they won't.
A shadow settled next to me, thank God. It was 9.30pm already. My friend Daz had arrived to save me any further mental crusading. At last I could do what I want to do in my local - enjoy myself! Beer and happy banter.
Our landlord was watching TV upstairs, but we still went outside with our fags!
Readers' comments
Who prosecutes the prosecutors? Over the past week I have witnessed over 5 local council employees smoking in council vehicles. Time to start recording tag numbers!
Good article Phil, unfortunatley your going to have to put up with the blind twoddle that Jon comes out with. How can a true, factual story be "extreme?" The only people with extreme views seem to be Jon in every "pro Smoking" (wrong again Jon) thread. As for people who are praying for one of their friends to arrive in the pub, you can see it everywhere, over the bar or when on a rare night out. There's almost a sigh of relief when someone they know turns up! its a sad (nanny) state of affairs.
I cannot understand 'Jons' comments at all. As a non smoker I am appalled at the emptyness created in pubs these days, in fact they have become boring lifeless establishments! I cannot see why fairness could not have prevailed insomuch that the phased out "snugs" were re-introduced so that smokers could still enjoy their nights out without being ostracised. As far as I can see the writer is merely pointing out the discrimmination now heaped against the smokers and licensees so I do not see 'Jon', how he is promoting "some bizarre extremist point of view". I also understand that perhaps you, like me, do not smoke but I'm afraid that I would rather have my smoking friends drinking in the pub with me instead of staying at home. Live and let live 'Jon', one day a law might be introduced that severely restricts one of your main pleasures!
In response to 'jon'. These views are not extreme. In fact they are moderate. These views are requesting equality and freedom to choose. These views want a choice for smoking and non smoking venues. How is that extreme? I also agree with these views as it was pubs and the smokers spending their money that allowed my single parent mother to put clothes on our backs and food on the table. If this legislation occurred 20 or 30 years ago, she would have been out of a job, and we might have been on the streets. Is that extreme enough for you? Next time you go in a pub. Look at who is serving you in your smoke free establishment and think about their lives. Married, kids, mortgage, debts? Apart from destroying one of the most celebrated aspects of British culture this legislation puts people on the dole. Do i sound extreme?
Explanatory notes on the Health act 2006 Say in article 57 which sets out the defence for a person charged with an offence, I quote 57a He/she took reasonable steps to stop the person smoking, such as requesting a person to stop smoking or taking steps to have the person evicted' If a landlord tells someone it is illegal to smoke in these premises as far as I can see he has fulfilled his duty, but that is for a judge to decide, as no case has been brought yet which outlines how he/she should enforce the smoking ban.
I hope someone will will furnish the landlady with this information, as she can appeal, the Health act 2006 Explanatory notes state quite clearly in article 57 (which sets out the defences of someone charged for an offence) I Quote 57b 'He/she did not know, and could not reasonably be expected to know that the person was smoking, for example if the manager was not present at the time the smoking occured'.
A real survey of how the Smoking ban is affecting pubs. http://www.ukip.org/ukip/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=596&Itemid=68
Jon - so now you advocate censorship as well as a smoking ban in pubs? The fact is - the ban is killing the trade, pubs are closing at a accelerating rate. We cannot shift the blame onto the higher beer prices, this is over played. Remember, if a smoker is willing to pay £5.50 for 20 fags, then a few pennies on a pint isn't going to make much difference. Its all relative - alcohol has always been cheaper in off license's and supermarkets. Its not purely about the cost, its about the whole package, going out having a pint and a fag. The fact is, the trade has more or less left it up to the customers to fight the ban. Publications like this saw it as a challenge, an opportunity to drag the tired old boozer into the 21st century. Get the families in, emphasise the food blah blah. Wishful thinking at best, in reality - delusional. We are entering a recession, people won't dine out as much. The smokers would bale you all out, given the chance. Why don't you give them a bit of support. After all, they have kept most pubs in business for generations.
More fiction from the pro-smokers? Seriously, how ethical is it to produce an article, then tell all your pro-smoking buddies about it so they can spam the comments section with rubbish? Can The Publican please restrict the blogs to those with a genuine interest in the licensed trade, rather than allow the website to be used to promote some bizarre, extremist point of view?
Oh my poor homeland. What has become of you? The one single joy of the common man has been dashed from his lips and his social circle forever broken by this awful law. I feel it was never about smoking. It was to destroy the pub trade. To deprive people of the right of peaceful assembly. It seems to be working.
An excellent read Phil and one which I totally agree with. Not only have this government turned its back on this industry, but they are now continuing to punish it by expecting licensees to act as untrained police officers, and if they do not oblige then they are hit with fines! This cannot be correct. They are there to provide a service to their customers, and enforcement officers are there (and paid) to enforce this draconian smokeban law. If these highly-paid jobsworth EFOs can't do their job and expect someone else to do it, then what are we paying them for! You're also right with the way you describe the down-turn of trade mid-week due to the ban, and something has to be done about this to prevent the continued demise of this industry. Lets bring choice, tolerance and humanity back into our country and into this trade
Yes Phil ... I find pubgoing more like a chore and certainly not to be undertaken lightly (speaking as a non-smoker in the pre-ban days). Prosecuting a publican for a crime committed when she was not on the premises is taking things to extremes. In general, after only two years, the money for smoking ban enforcement is no longer ringfenced in Scotland, meaning that proprietors are meant to uphold a law when there is no dedicated public provision for enforcement, rather than an assumption that the size of the fines, should one be caught out, are enough to put people off flouting the law. The trade bodies should be up in arms! But perhaps they are too demoralised ...?
You are spot on Phil, it should not be up to the Landlord/Lady to enforce this Nazi ban,this Government will not be happy until all the Pubs/Clubs are out of business,where will people meet to discuss such topics as,well, politics for example?,it is time the Country woke up and said,enough is enough,we should all have the same freedom in this Country and who could say no,cheers,Tug.
well said phil. most pubs are empty now, either smokers and non smokers sitting in the smoking area or they just don.t come in the pubs at all. this government stinks.